<br><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Thu, Sep 20, 2012 at 10:35 AM, Jon Crowcroft <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:Jon.Crowcroft@cl.cam.ac.uk" target="_blank">Jon.Crowcroft@cl.cam.ac.uk</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
Ah - I see the source of confusion.<br>
<br>
You want to build a standby infrastructure<br>
<br>
There are lots of ways to do that -<br>
<br>
One is to build standby cell power<br>
(solar, diesel - so long as you have sunlight<br>
or your dieel isnt flooded or disconnected<br>
the way the generators at fukushima were)<br>
or have huge racks of batteries the way old<br>
phone exchanges did, which were engineered for a 100years MTBF (fail<br>
defined as >50% of lines down) -<br>
Indeed, the ITU charity organisation has solar<br>
powered base stations with satellite uplinks already in fact...<br></blockquote><div></div><div><br>Cool. <br> </div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
Or you can build an +alternative+ infrastructure - one which is parallel in<br>
technology - as you've proposed....and go figure out how to get either of<br>
those paid for ....you need a lot of stuff and some business model<br>
<br>
However, its beside the point:<br>
The mistake you make is that you think people in a disaster zone want to<br>
make long haul phone calls (like Keanu Reeves in Johnny Mnemonic)...<br>
they don't. what they want is to find other people _nearby_<br>
who have safe water, dry<br>
clothes, medicine and expterise, shelter etc -<br></blockquote><div><br>No I don't do this mistake. <br><br>***The base station can serve for the calling the neighborhood too***. <br><br>MANET looks like nothing but a research exercise to me. <br>
<br>It is not needed as you admitted above. <br><br><br> </div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
What people building DTNs<br>
(not just MANETs as you keep insisting incorrectly)<br>
want to do is to provide _something_ for a<br>
self organising set of people to<br>
self organise opportunistic communication,<br>
UNTIL someone (else) comes along<br>
and fixes the infrastructure some while later usually<br>
(because coming along right away requires you to have<br>
massive rescue teams on standby 24*7 -<br>
go figure out how get that paid for).<br>
<br>
Anyhow I'd forgotten about the dual pathologies present on mail lists -<br>
<br>
One has already been alluded to - the other is my own error<br>
in assuming that it was still my duty in public online fora to<br>
discuss, explain, reach understanding about stuff - that's obviously<br>
not the point any more. (lord knows what's left then, though).<br>
<br>
of course, the pathological behaviours depend on each other,<br>
so I will now go away and meditate on my bad ways for a bit<br>
while listening to 'Blood' playing<br>
Jazz is the teacher, funk is the preacher<br>
<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y9g6ZJjt9lg" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y9g6ZJjt9lg</a><br>
<br>
Its been, er, virtual...<br>
<br>
<br>
In missive <CACQuieaSzr6RMz9V57JdQwERYF=<a href="mailto:yf18msEv0dg-4rs6t8_OHCA@mail.gmail.com">yf18msEv0dg-4rs6t8_OHCA@mail.gmail.com</a>>, Par<br>
s Mutaf typed:<br>
<br>
>>--bcaec51a8b864356cb04ca1cfac8<br>
>>Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1<br>
<div class="HOEnZb"><div class="h5"> >><br>
>>In summary, why MANET is a bad idea:<br>
>><br>
>>1. We need to reconstruct the infrastructure, otherwise MANET will only be<br>
>>useful to talk to my neighborhood who have no idea what to do. I would<br>
>>rather wait for real help instead of consuming my battery for trying to get<br>
>>help from non-professional strangers.<br>
>><br>
>>This means that users really have no incentive to consume energy for others<br>
>>because they are waiting for real help. And this is what they should do.<br>
>><br>
>>You can of course try to reach your neighbors for your broken leg, request<br>
>>water from your non-professional neighbors or other things, but I am not<br>
>>sure if this is a good idea. What real help they can provide?<br>
>><br>
>>2. If I am too far from the network I cannot reach anyone. Some people<br>
>>suggested using long range wifi, but I don't have this in my pocket.<br>
>><br>
>>Therefore:<br>
>><br>
>>The balloons should be installed as fast as possible. It will broadcast an<br>
>>address which everyone can call for real help.<br>
>><br>
>>This is really not a networking problem. It is about education.<br>
>><br>
>>===<br>
>><br>
>>I am also not sure if the cellular network is not robust enough, we may not<br>
>>even need a balloon:<br>
>><br>
>><a href="http://www.trust.org/alertnet/blogs/alertnet-news-blog/cell-phones-and-radios-help-save-lives-after-haiti-earthquake/" target="_blank">http://www.trust.org/alertnet/blogs/alertnet-news-blog/cell-phones-and-radios-help-save-lives-after-haiti-earthquake/</a><br>
>><br>
</div></div></blockquote></div><br><br clear="all"><br>-- <br><a href="http://www.content-based-science.org" target="_blank">http://www.content-based-science.org</a><br><br>